Nikki Lada
Senior Niva Petrol Head
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Jul 10, 2011 8:16:22 GMT 2
Post by Nikki Lada on Jul 10, 2011 8:16:22 GMT 2
Thanks for all the tips on cleaning off the old oil. After what Spikes said, and to avoid any possible damage to Nikita ( who trembles in her CV boots every time she goes near a garage workshop) I decided against letting anyone loose on her with industrial high pressure sprays. I then bought a few litres of petrol and insecticide sprays but when I read what Ronnie said I decided this wouldn’t work either as I have neither a compressor nor a high pressure washer. So, I eventually bought some engine cleaner which worked quite well but I had to spend quite a bit of time brushing it into the ‘honeycomb’ areas. I must say, though, I found it quite relaxing lying on my tarpaulin in the afternoon sun brushing away and listening to some good music! ;D Everything looks much better now but there is still a lot of gunk in the areas towards the top of both the gearbox and transfer box suggesting that oil may have been blowing out of there for some time. I’ll clean off these areas a bit more today and I should then be able to see if there are any leaks. Thanks again guys - I really appreciate all the assistance. NIKKI
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Jul 10, 2011 9:14:27 GMT 2
Post by marius on Jul 10, 2011 9:14:27 GMT 2
Hi Nikki
Sorry for my belated response - bit hectic over here - but yes engine cleaner is perfect. Just be careful as it is quite harsh and burns like hell when it gets into your eyes.
I do hope you have better taste in music than the rest of our compatriots! ;D ;D ;D
Marius
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Jul 10, 2011 9:27:32 GMT 2
Post by marius on Jul 10, 2011 9:27:32 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie
Stupid question but how were you able to pick up the busted bearings on the steering box?
The guy who did my wheel alignment did pick up a tiny amount of play on the idler arm bushes - something I will have to look at some time in the future.
Marius
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Jul 10, 2011 12:24:50 GMT 2
Post by ronnie on Jul 10, 2011 12:24:50 GMT 2
Hi Marius
When I opened the box the cage (plastic) around the bearing was badly broken. The bearing is non standard and is not available locally. We have removed the cage and put the maximum no of balls in (8mm) to nearly fill the space.
Ronnie
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Jul 10, 2011 16:07:24 GMT 2
Post by marius on Jul 10, 2011 16:07:24 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie
From your answer I gather you discovered the problem by chance - or was there a particular reason for opening the box?
Marius
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Jul 10, 2011 16:15:06 GMT 2
Post by Charles on Jul 10, 2011 16:15:06 GMT 2
They cleaned the grease out and put in some of Vincent's "special" oil.
Charles
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vincentc
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Jul 10, 2011 16:54:12 GMT 2
Post by vincentc on Jul 10, 2011 16:54:12 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie Stupid question but how were you able to pick up the busted bearings on the steering box? The guy who did my wheel alignment did pick up a tiny amount of play on the idler arm bushes - something I will have to look at some time in the future. Marius Hi Marius I recently replaced idler arm bushes and its REALLY easy if you remove the battary and battery mount. I have made a drawing of the bush that will allow all to have them made up out of vesconite. Put a grease nipple on the adler arm mount while you are at it. regards Vincent
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vincentc
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Jul 10, 2011 16:55:13 GMT 2
Post by vincentc on Jul 10, 2011 16:55:13 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie From your answer I gather you discovered the problem by chance - or was there a particular reason for opening the box? Marius Ronnie was bored ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D My Lada was parked in the way and he could not move his. Regards Vincent
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Jul 10, 2011 17:17:25 GMT 2
Post by marius on Jul 10, 2011 17:17:25 GMT 2
Hi Marius I recently replaced idler arm bushes and its REALLY easy if you remove the battary and battery mount. I have made a drawing of the bush that will allow all to have them made up out of vesconite. Put a grease nipple on the adler arm mount while you are at it. regards Vincent Thanks Vincent for the advice. Have you posted the drawing as I would be interested? Marius
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vincentc
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Jul 18, 2011 16:13:29 GMT 2
Post by vincentc on Jul 18, 2011 16:13:29 GMT 2
HI Marius
My CAD skills are like my Niva - Rusty. I will post the drawing once I have it nicely cadded and PDFed.
You might in the mean time hunt down some Vesconite rod with an OD of at least 35mm and length 50mm
Regards Vincent
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vincentc
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Jul 18, 2011 17:14:05 GMT 2
Post by vincentc on Jul 18, 2011 17:14:05 GMT 2
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spikes
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Jul 18, 2011 19:16:38 GMT 2
Post by spikes on Jul 18, 2011 19:16:38 GMT 2
Thanks. I'll hunt up a piece of vesconite when next I am in Steelpoort, The mine uses it for the roller carrying the ore.
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justincase
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Aug 9, 2011 21:29:39 GMT 2
Post by justincase on Aug 9, 2011 21:29:39 GMT 2
So, I spent a couple of hours with the Niva stuck in a glacial river about a month ago. Finally got around to changing the oils (after having just done it less than 1000kms ago!) and of course they needed it. The oil in both front and rear diffs was contaminated – I did the 'crackle test' and the oil boiled – but strangely enough, all the oils were different colors! I have now replaced the breathers on both diffs and the transfer case with hoses which go to the engine bay, but I can't get at the gearbox breather so that one will have to wait. My question now is: how can I check to see if the seals need replacing without taking everything apart? There are oil stains on most of the parts, but they don't seem to be getting any bigger and I have since been through many more (and higher) rivers without any problems. here are some photos: Attachments:
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Aug 9, 2011 23:11:32 GMT 2
Post by Charles on Aug 9, 2011 23:11:32 GMT 2
Thaty oil looks really bad. How did you get the Niva unstuck?
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justincase
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Aug 10, 2011 0:24:36 GMT 2
Post by justincase on Aug 10, 2011 0:24:36 GMT 2
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Aug 10, 2011 8:23:40 GMT 2
Post by marius on Aug 10, 2011 8:23:40 GMT 2
Hi Eric I think you have done well with the hoses - you should try and do the gearbox too. That water must be freezing cold! All I can say about the seals - you will definitely see when a seal is leaking oil as things will be covered in fresh oil. I have not seen that Iveco before - it looks very tough for a modern commercial 4x4. Marius
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Aug 10, 2011 17:36:44 GMT 2
Post by ronnie on Aug 10, 2011 17:36:44 GMT 2
Hi Justin
Not sure, but I think if you drop the gear box as far as possible at the back you might just be able to lever out the existing breather.
Ronnie
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justincase
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Aug 11, 2011 0:09:31 GMT 2
Post by justincase on Aug 11, 2011 0:09:31 GMT 2
Marius -
Thanks for the advice. I cleaned up all the gunk around the inner CV joints and will keep a close eye on things to see if the leak continues. I am more worried about water getting IN than oil getting OUT right now!
I just checked the oil in the gearbox and it looks like... OIL! Not coffee creamer or pea soup, just oil.
Since that is the breather most 'protected' I am going to leave it alone for now. I've been through a dozen more rivers – some deeper, over the bonnet a few times – since getting stuck and things have been fine.
Always learning... even when you ford a river in one direction, don't assume it will be safe to go the same way back! ALWAYS check a fast flowing river ESPECIALLY when you can't see the bottom. Enter SLOWLY in LOW with plenty of power ready in case things get tough. Try to enter so that you will be traveling in the direction of the current in a fast-flowing river so that the stream will push you in the right direction.
And my new rule: anything higher than my Wellingtons, I don't go through alone!
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Aug 11, 2011 8:02:22 GMT 2
Post by marius on Aug 11, 2011 8:02:22 GMT 2
Hi Eric
Normally the breathers do the job but I think the huge difference between the water and the boxes can cause problems but I do think you should be fine now.
Water crossings can be very unpredictable - over here you can even bump into a crocodile! ;D
You are supposed to walk into the water first, but I have not seen many people do that. Fast flowing rivers can be serious trouble and I would avoid it. The diff lock should be engaged at all times when crossing a river.
The other important thing to remember is when the car stalls - never to try and start it when the exhaust is covered in water.
Marius
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vincentc
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Aug 19, 2011 21:03:55 GMT 2
Post by vincentc on Aug 19, 2011 21:03:55 GMT 2
So, I spent a couple of hours with the Niva stuck in a glacial river about a month ago. Finally got around to changing the oils (after having just done it less than 1000kms ago!) and of course they needed it. The oil in both front and rear diffs was contaminated – I did the 'crackle test' and the oil boiled – but strangely enough, all the oils were different colors! I have now replaced the breathers on both diffs and the transfer case with hoses which go to the engine bay, but I can't get at the gearbox breather so that one will have to wait. My question now is: how can I check to see if the seals need replacing without taking everything apart? There are oil stains on most of the parts, but they don't seem to be getting any bigger and I have since been through many more (and higher) rivers without any problems. here are some photos: Hi Justincase Your oils are contaminated with water Your best solution would be a water proof lubricant such as the one on the following link:- www.le-international.com/productdisplay.aspx?id=49The lubricant would only then need the free water drained off and you are good to go again. Raising your breathers is a worthwhile exercise as that is the water entry point. As the diff or gear box contract and cool from the water that you are dunking them in, they "suck" water into the component. The result can then be seen as your photos very clearly show. Nice story, but unless the water is 24 Deg C there is NO WAY I would be getting into the water. Regards Vincent
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vincentc
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Aug 19, 2011 21:07:37 GMT 2
Post by vincentc on Aug 19, 2011 21:07:37 GMT 2
Ahh yes and as Marius pointed out "Flat Dogs" can be lurking in our rivers. The Ozzie members also have their "Salties" to deal with too.
Regards Vincent
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Sept 20, 2012 9:31:07 GMT 2
Post by marius on Sept 20, 2012 9:31:07 GMT 2
Just as a matter of interest: A scan from the Operation Manual Lada Niva 4x4 (p38) indicating the Russian specs for fuels, lubricants and fluids. Interesting to note that the Russians did not specify the 20W50 engine oil which is a very common spec oil in South Africa. The same goes for the 85W140 diff oils. This is most probably due to their very different and extreme climatic conditions. Marius
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Sept 20, 2012 9:41:29 GMT 2
Post by marius on Sept 20, 2012 9:41:29 GMT 2
Another scan from our Service & Warranty Book showing the initial fills on the particular vehicle. For our foreign members "Engen" correspond to either Mobil or Petronas lubricants. Engen Dieselube 500 Super is a 15W40 spec mineral oil. Our Niva's engin has been filled with 15W40 for most part except on two occasion when availability was an issue. I used 20W50 instead. Interesting to note the EP 90 spec on the gearbox. I also ran 85W90 on the diffs and TC for many years but later switched back to 85W140. Gear oil has mostly been GL5 spec. Marius
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