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Post by danie on Nov 4, 2009 22:16:57 GMT 2
Since I bought my Lada four years ago, I became beware of warnings against any bigger than standard wheels on Lada Nivas.
According to this warnings, bigger wheels will cause:
1. Broken front wheel hubs. 2. Broken sideshafts at the back axle. 3. A broken back axle. 4. Wheel bearing problems. 5. Extraordinary wear on the Steering Box.
I thought it might be interested if Lada owners who do have experience with bigger wheels on their vehicles, could report any problems, or pass comments under this topic.
My own experience is as follows:
The previous owner fitted 205/70/R15 Kumho tyres on my Lada. Just after I bought the car , all wheel bearings has been changed - since then, my Lada has covered more than 60 000 km, without any of the above mentioned problems.
My opinion regarding my own experience is:
1.I do beleive that the wheel bearings on my Lada will not last as long as with Ladas with standard wheels - but with 60 000 km already, and more to come - I am very happy. I do like the bigger wheels, and I do not have any intention of changing wheels at all.
2. The Kumho tyres on my Lada will probably cover another 20 000 km - which means a total of more than 80 000 km. I beleive that this high milage will eventually compensate for the extra cost of more regular wheelbearing changes - so the extra cost do not bother me at all. The Kumho tyres are obviously more expensive, but that does not worry me either.
3. I beleive that misuse, and reckless driving, has caused far more broken hubs, broken sideshafts, and broken back axles, than bigger wheels did. Owners should rather be warned against reckless driving, than bigger wheels.
4. I beleive that the lifespan of my Lada's steering box will eventually be shortened, because of "heavier" steering. I must say though - I recently took the steering box apart for inspection / service, and could not find any problem. To my mind, most problems with steering boxes are caused due to a lack of proper lubrication / maintenance - and not by bigger wheels.
Please be free to share your own experience.
Regards
Danie
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Post by hotstuff on Nov 4, 2009 23:50:06 GMT 2
Danie you a absolutely right, but bigger tyres do mess the bearings up, but only after time and as you say bad driving and lack of maintenance.
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Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Nov 5, 2009 20:05:34 GMT 2
I think that when you have bigger wheels on you think you can just drive anywhere without looking where you are going but if you are careful and know the vehicle's and your own limitations it should not be such a problem. My father drove the baviaans pass in a Fiat Uno with 13" wheels so it proves that slowly and gently can do it and go anywhere.
If you are running broader wheels you can pump them harder this will make it easier on the steering box as the area in contact with the ground is then less.
Ari
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Hercules
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Post by Hercules on Nov 5, 2009 20:52:58 GMT 2
When I bought my Lada it had 147000km on with 195/70 SR15 Geolanders. I fitted on 158000km a set of Bridgestone Duelers 205/70 SR15 that came of a Lada with bearing problems on my Lada.
The Lada with bearing problems was at Jan for repairs and went back 3 times in a matter of 2 weeks. Jan told the owner, who is a lady that the tyres is to big and that is why the bearings packed up twice in 2weeks time. The 3rd time that this Lady went to Jan was for a broken lower control ball joint. The lady did put on 195/70 SR15 and took the 205 tyres from her. After that her Lada went back with a broken left front stub axle plus a new set of bearings again.
I used to service her Lada regularly which at that stage I refused. My conclusion came to the fact that her son, 19 years of age, droved her car every weekend in a open field with his buddy's on scramblers and actually diced each other. Further more she work for Dunlop Tyres and every time the vehicle came back from Jan, they contact me to get the wheel bearing settings, as to them the bearings are to loose. When I give the settings, they say something is wrong with the settings, the clearance is to big.
My Lada is on 198600km, the bearings still 100% and my steering got a little bit of play the last month or so. After an inspection I found a worn lower ball joint on the left front wheel. I will replace the ball joints next month when the car will get a major service on 200000km. I also up-till now never adjust the wheel bearings.
If you drive this vehicle like a hooligan, it will break and also if people who does not know the vehicle, work on them and do adjustments they don't know about, then you will get problems.
This is my experience with wheel bearings. I also believe if something does not give a problem, why tamper with it.
Regards.
Hercules.
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Post by danie on Nov 6, 2009 19:13:20 GMT 2
Hercules, thank you very much for your reply.
According to my calculations, you have covered 51 600 km with bigger wheels on your Lada - also without problems.
To be very honest, I regard this rumour about :
1. Broken front wheel hubs 2. Broken sideshafts at the back axle, and 3. A broken back axle,
caused by bigger wheels on Ladas, as absolute nonsence !
I think the time has arrive to clear this issue for once and all : Ladas are not "fool proof" (never meant to be) and if anyone drives them like an idiot, something is going to break !
In fact, I am aware of reports about Ladas, fitted with standard wheels which ended up with exactly the same mentioned problems: broken hubs, sideshafts, and axles, - caused by misuse !
Bottom line - anyone who drives his / her Lada with respect, even fitted with bigger wheels , could experience many years of happy 4 X 4 driving !
Anyway, I honestly hope that more Lada owners will use this opportunity to share their own experience in this regard..........
Regards
Danie
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Hercules
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Post by Hercules on Nov 6, 2009 19:40:01 GMT 2
Thanks Danie, there is a saying - any monkey can break a car but it is an art the get the most out of a car without any damage or breakage. I got about 6000km left on the rear tyres and start looking at some other makes of tyres due to that Bridgestone is very expensive. I did had a look at the Kumho, also because they are well priced. The only problem I has is that I don't know the make and was not sure of the handling and lifespan of them. After reading your report, I am at ease that Kumho gonna be my next set of tyres and it will be 205/70 SR15 again.
Regards.
Hercules.
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Post by danie on Nov 7, 2009 18:42:06 GMT 2
Hercules, the Kumho's on my Lada are Radial 798's - perhaps not perfect for serious offroad driving, but perfect for average driving conditions. I am not sure about current price though.
As far as the warnings in South Africa about bigger wheels is concerned - I raised a question in this regard on the Ladanivabelgium Forum, about three years ago.........and discovered that none of the forum members, while some of their Ladas had been fitted with bigger wheels than mine, ever experienced any broken wheel hubs, sideshafts, or back axles !
Sorry to say, I regard this so called "warnings" about broken components (mentioned above) as pure thumbsucking.........
Danie
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Hercules
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Post by Hercules on Nov 7, 2009 19:48:57 GMT 2
Danie, thanks for the info on your tyres, it is definitely the correct tyres for me as my driving is 98% of time on tar or dirt roads for weekend camping at dams and rivers, 2% of time spent in rugged off road terrain. My Duelers is 693 AT and also not for extreme off road, as my vehicle is used as a daily vehicle as well.
As of damaged wheel bearings and stub axles, the problem occur 95% of time from bearings set to tight, to much ghrease or not enough ghrease or wrong type of ghrease. The bearings heat up and seized and damage the stub axles or just collapsed. If looked at the pictures of stub axles on Jan's web site, the damage is clearly caused by seized bearings. To much ghrease is more harmful to a bearing than to little ghrease because the bearing will generate more heat than usual. If not sure, rather set the bearings slightly on the loose side and with to little ghrease,then the bearings will last longer than with an over tide setting and over packed with ghrease. The rest of 2% damage is caused by hitting holes or objects at a to high speed and 3% by people driving to long with damaged bearings before replacing them.
Further more people must also realized that bearings only last so long and then packed up. Bearings can't last for ever.
I saw this type of damage on various other makes of vehicles with standard tyres on and not only on Lada's. The other problem is that some of the service stations take the public for a ride and replace bearings and stub axles just to make an extra buck or two. Most of the public is not technical and believe what the service people tell them. This also damage the good name and reliability of a vehicle.
Further more are their a lot of service people when hearing you drive a Lada, spreading the word around that a Lada got wheel bearing problems, and this is heared by other people and spreading the word further more, but actually none of them got any knowledge of the Lada
Regards.
Hercules.
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Post by hotstuff on Nov 7, 2009 22:16:56 GMT 2
WELL PUT I TOTALLY AGREE IT'S ALL IN WHO AND HOW YOU DRIVE AND SERVICE OR FIX THE LADA..."NOTHING LASTS FOREVER BUT IN A LADA IT'S LIKE AN AK47 JUST KEEPS GOING UNTILL IT REALLY BREAKS DOWN"
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Post by danie on Nov 8, 2009 8:05:24 GMT 2
Hercules, I must congradulate you - your comments regarding wheelbearing settings, and lubrication ,is one of the most sensable explanations that I have ever seen on any Lada forum - across the globe !
It is obvious that even on a Ladas with standard wheels - but with incorrect wheelbearing settings, and insufficient lubrication, the hubs could overheat, and collapse !
I think the message to all Lada Niva owners is very obvious - maintenance, and settings on the front wheel bearings should never be neglected - not even on a Lada with standard wheels !
And to all owners of Ladas with bigger wheels : Just remember - the offset on non standard rims is incorrect - which puts more strain on the wheel bearings. Therefore wheelbearing maintenance should obviously never been neglected.
So - I cannot see any reason for "throwing away" bigger wheels, and then "throwing" hard earned money at rims with standard wheels..........the standard size 16' tyres are extremely scarse, and hard to find anyway. Rather spend your money on regular wheelbearing maintenance............
To any owner of a Lada in the East Rand area - with bigger wheels on his / her Lada: I would advice you rather to take your Lada to Hercules for proper maintenance......... Hercules clearly knows what he is talking about.
Danie
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Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Nov 16, 2009 19:15:02 GMT 2
I also think Hercules is right as when my father bought our lada it had the 15" Smith wheels and 195 tyres in 2000 , but the wheel bearings needed replacing.
Since replacing the wheel bearings he has run 205/16 tyres until 2007 and for the last 2 years I have been running 215/15 conti trac AT tyres
Ari
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Post by ronnie on Feb 7, 2010 15:58:39 GMT 2
My Lada is running on KHUMO Road venture tyres 195 R15 100S they handle very well on road and are for mud and snow. looking at them they would not be much good in mud. Very often changing tyres sizes can affect the spedo readings. I checked mine yesterday with the GPS and was surprised to find it showed the spedo to be 100% accurate, from 60 through to 120. I personally would go with Ari"s choice and use Conti Trac.
Regards
Ronnie
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Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Feb 7, 2010 16:13:10 GMT 2
The Conti tyres were bought 2nd hand with the mag wheels, which do have a larger offset. When blown down to 1.2 bar they are very good offroad. I have even surprised myself by going someplaces I did not think possible after the willy's jeep my father was driving did not make it. Regards Ari
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Post by ronnie on Feb 7, 2010 18:47:22 GMT 2
Hi Ari.
Conti trac are my personal choice and I have tried all the expensive ones and I always come back to conti trac as value for money and good on and off road.
regards
Ronnie
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darryn
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Post by darryn on Mar 16, 2010 22:46:29 GMT 2
Anyone have ideas as to what tyres I can put on the Lada this coming weekend? It still has all five original rims, which is cool, but I've gotten stuck trying to find something that will fit. The only ones that will fit the 6J profile that I could find on the interweb are continental vanco 8 (light commercial vehicle) and Barum Vanis (distributed by Conti). No steel bands in these puppies. WTF do I do now?
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Post by lada & korean parts on Mar 17, 2010 1:54:28 GMT 2
mmmmmmm,interesting.......
the only thing i knew of for cause of breaking rear axles was those detroit lockers....
as far as bearing wear etc was concerned,was more with non gen/incorrect offset wheels fitted..........
with std wheels,when you drop your hand from top edge of rim to bottom,you hit the hub/wheel nuts in the centre. with incorrect rims (e.g.suzuki) there is a deep dish,so wheels are stepped out further.....
this will load the front end a lot more,makes it hell of lot heavier to steer,stuffs turning circle up,and WILL cause premature wear of wheel bearings,ball joints,tie rod ends,and have had a number of steering & idler boxes smashed with these fitted (very RARE with std wheels)
apparently it will also affect rear bearings,but most problems at front end.
TRUE STORY
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bobbyd
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Post by bobbyd on Mar 17, 2010 3:49:23 GMT 2
I would do everything I could to look after my steering box, evidently RHD steering boxs are as rear hens teeth.
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Post by lada & korean parts on Mar 17, 2010 6:07:38 GMT 2
REALLY? ? someone told me they were rarer than rocking horse do-do......... so,who's right???
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bobbyd
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Post by bobbyd on Mar 17, 2010 6:12:42 GMT 2
Maybe rocking horse teeth bro?
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Post by lada & korean parts on Mar 17, 2010 8:05:05 GMT 2
Maybe rocking horse teeth bro? ;D
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Post by danie on Mar 17, 2010 18:22:02 GMT 2
Steering box maintenance often gets neglected by owners. The boxes tend to leak oil, runs dry, and then gets worn.
About a year ago I packed both my steering boxes (got a spare one as well) with CV joint grease - very smooth now.
Regards
Danie
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Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Mar 17, 2010 19:24:24 GMT 2
I can guess who is going to be the victim of crime now and who can guess what will be stolen?
Steering box and other lada parts
what the criminals left behind
TV DVD hiFi cars etc
There are weird criminals and the police will be really confused
Ari
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Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Mar 17, 2010 19:25:12 GMT 2
Oh sorry the SA police are generally confused Ari
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Apr 23, 2010 19:24:14 GMT 2
Hi, I can relax!! The Lada I took delivery of today has Khumo 195/70/15 on so all should be A Ok. The spare is the original russian rim and tyre. Does not look as if it has ever been used Spikes
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Post by ronnie on Apr 23, 2010 20:04:13 GMT 2
Hi Spikes
Congratulations now you can play all weekend ;D
Regards
Ronnie
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Post by danie on Apr 23, 2010 20:53:12 GMT 2
Hi Spikes The Kumhos are excellent tyres and gives high mileage. Mine are slightly wider (205 / 70 / R15) , on 7" Trailduster rims.
Enjoy the Lada.
Regards
Danie
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Jun 10, 2010 20:01:50 GMT 2
Hi all, The Lada has been quite ill.. someone took the gearlever out by undoing the inner three nuts. Usual damage when the pins and springs went the box. Back on the road now, gearbox and transfer case properly aligned with no drive train vibrations. As a PS, I agree that a more formalised club/forum will be beneficial in the long term, but looking at the stats lots of viewing.reading taking place but little response from forum. cheers Spikes
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Post by ronnie on Jun 11, 2010 9:50:26 GMT 2
Hi Spikes Nice to hear from you, sorry you have had problems. I am sure plenty of people have made the mistake with these bolts . Any way please keep us informed how your Lada is running and hope you now have many enjoyable KMS in it . Regards Ronnie
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Aug 24, 2010 19:42:08 GMT 2
Hi all, Here is a handy link to calculate wheel offset www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible_pg4.htmlSelect the tyre and wheel bible then scroll to the calculator In anticipation of the imported tyres:) Regards Spikes
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Post by marius on Aug 24, 2010 19:47:31 GMT 2
Hi Spikes
I'm on a mission with those tyres and will not rest untill I succeed.
Regards Marius
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