spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 18:41:34 GMT 2
As a thinker, I sometimes think to much. The following pictures will tell the cautionary tale of me making a new fuel filler cap. It sealed very well and I thought it would be ok, because my niva has a vapour separator box. I made the new plug/cap from a poly urethane suspension bush. Cost me a 2l coke and a handshake at the local spring shop. The fuel pushed into the vapour box, drained into the cavity around the petrol tank and flooded the rear foot well. I noticed the severe petrol smell and new that I would have to check the vapour box, but then noticed a black liquid draining from the body work. I then found the petrol about 20 mm deep sloshing around where my mother-in-law would have her feet. Unfortunately she was not in the car. The black liquid was the petrol disolving the rubber mat and the tar/bitumen insulation on the floor in the rear. I spent yesterday afternoon cleaning it out and flushed the lot with engine cleaner to get the petrol smell out. It worked, but now I have an engine cleaner smell. Still better than petrol, I guess. Went to a big cloth and material place this morning and got new underfelt and rubber matting for cars. Nothing restores that new car smell in a lada than some fresh rubber! ;D The cap has been adapted and is now breathing normally. Spencer
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 18:42:10 GMT 2
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 18:44:19 GMT 2
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 18:44:39 GMT 2
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 18:45:13 GMT 2
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Post by ronnie on Jan 30, 2011 18:56:12 GMT 2
Hi Spencer
I don`t know about the injected Niva but on a carb model the cap should be sealed. The tank breaths through the separator and exits just above the petrol filler cap. If there are no leaks in the pipe work the petrol will only be able to leak from that breather pipe above the filler cap.
Ronnie
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 18:59:02 GMT 2
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 19:01:08 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie.
I have a pipe running from the breather box back down into the vehicle. It might be a mod, but it looks very russian.
Spencer
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Jan 30, 2011 19:05:27 GMT 2
Hi Spencer The original cap does not have a breathing hole. Two vents are provided, one at the black canister L/front of engine compt and a tank vent pipe that connects to the filler pipe above the connections that run to the evaporator tank. Do you have the TBI specific manual? It gives a number of checks that can be carried out. It is not included in the 1.7 manual on our home page. You can run the NIVA without the cat but the Lambda sensor has to stay. Regards Spikes
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Post by Charles on Jan 30, 2011 19:08:29 GMT 2
Hi Spencer
May I ask how much was the rubber matting? Charles
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Post by ronnie on Jan 30, 2011 19:15:19 GMT 2
Hi Spencer
I can`t check the parts manual as I am using Freda`s lap top as mine was stolen. I will down load new copies when I sort out the laptop situation. The separator in the rear wing should have 3 pipes. The large one goes from the top of the separator to just above the petrol filler cap. The 2 small ones, one from each side of the petrol tank go to the bottom of the separator. Be very careful as these tanks are notorious for leaking. Even trying to remove the pipes is enough to cause leaks. Soften the pipes with a hairdryer before removing them or replacing them. If your system is the same as the carb model check the separator carefully.
Ronnie
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 19:20:39 GMT 2
Hi Charles.
The mat was R195/m at the Chamdor Faktry(their spelling) Shop. It's one big ass material store.
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 19:24:34 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie/Spikes.
I checked the drawings and manuals yesterday, thats how I noticed the extra pipe running back down.
This was the first time I filled it up completely, so I cant say what the situation would have been with a ventilating/open filling cap.
You guys do have me a bit worried, though. Spencer
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Jan 30, 2011 19:25:40 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie and all I have PM'ed Spencer earlier on the pipes of the Evp tank but this mod may be worth sharing Mine was broken off. I re-enforced the small pipes with the tubing cut from a suitable sized pop rivet. Glued the whole lot back with "Q-bond" and its gray powder. That was about 8000km ago.Still fine no smell at all. Did not have camera with me so pics. regards Spikes
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 19:34:47 GMT 2
Spikes, I did inspect the evp tank and could not see any obvious cracks or damage. I did have a petrol smell previously, but thougt that was because I had no filler cap on.
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 19:37:42 GMT 2
And you can use any superglue with bicarbonate of soda in the same manner as the q-bond. I repaired the little pipe fitting on my throttle body like that.
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Post by danie on Jan 30, 2011 20:05:12 GMT 2
Hi Spencer Nice mod - as long as it works and it ensures that your relationship with your skoonma is not too shaky , anything is acceptable. A petrol leak at my Lada's petrol cap area once destroyed a huge patch of newly laid Bitumen right at our front door of our house at the complex where we lived before. Needless to say my Lada was not very popular amoungst some residents afterwards . Danie
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Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Jan 30, 2011 20:09:36 GMT 2
Hi Danie
Petrol and diesel have that effect, thats why petrol stations have tar, paving or concrete.
Ari
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 30, 2011 20:11:36 GMT 2
Hi Danie.
Yeah, I found complex living was too complex for me as well...
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Post by ronnie on Jan 30, 2011 21:42:25 GMT 2
Hi Spencer
If you had a petrol smell previously, that separator is the prime suspect. I have done similar to Spikes and only time will tell if it lasts.
Ronnie.
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spencer
Full Niva Petrol Head
"In Soviet Russia, Niva drives you"
Posts: 208
Location: Gauteng
Town: Krugersdorp
Registered: Dec 30, 2010 18:10:53 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
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Post by spencer on Jan 31, 2011 6:37:13 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie.
I checked it but did not remove the separator. Would damage be openly visible? The connecting pipes were intact.
Chris
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Post by ronnie on Jan 31, 2011 9:00:52 GMT 2
Hi Spencer
If you can remove the tank, it comes out right at the back. I use the only way I have of testing for a leak. Block the 2 small pipes with your fingers and suck on the other pipe then block it with you tongue, and see if it will hold a vacuum. Very primitive but it works.
Ronnie
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Jan 31, 2011 11:13:30 GMT 2
Hi Chris If you decide to pull the Evp tank out , get your repair kit handy. You will need it. Only one pipe was broken on mine, but when I replaced it and fitted the new hose to it, the other pipe broke as well Regards Spikes
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Post by marius on Feb 1, 2011 7:51:01 GMT 2
Hi all
I completely removed the black box and linked all the pipes with a T and some duck tape. That got rid of the smell but sometimes I can smell heavy vapor coming from the overflow pipe near the cap.
Would removing the box be hazardous in any way?
Regards Marius
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Feb 1, 2011 8:02:24 GMT 2
Hi Marius, I don't think so. But where does your overflow pipe now lead to? Those fumes will obviously have some risk attached> groete Spikes
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Post by marius on Feb 1, 2011 8:40:27 GMT 2
Hi Spikes
The overflow pipe ends where it should - just above the filler cap.
Regards Marius
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Post by ronnie on Feb 1, 2011 9:54:08 GMT 2
Hi Marius
The tank can only be there to contain the quantity of petrol pushed into it as the petrol expands with heat. The worst that can happen with your set up is it could push petrol out the overflow above the cap. I have been thinking about making a "tank" out of a 3/4" copper pipe and some bends to basically make a "w" shape mounted on it`s side. This will give it some capacity. Using copper because it can be soldered. 2 small pipes at the bottom and a bigger one at the top. Hope this makes some sense.
Ronnie
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Post by Charles on Feb 1, 2011 10:09:16 GMT 2
Ronnie how do you manage to have a solution for everything? Im jelous.
Charles
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Post by marius on Feb 1, 2011 10:31:00 GMT 2
Yes Charles Ronnie is a walking repair manual ;D
Ronnie - fortunately no fuel has made their escape this way. the overflow pipe is actually quite long and makes a few turns on it's way. My first car - a Golf - was spitting fuel through the overflow like crazy when hot.
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spikes
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Post by spikes on Feb 1, 2011 11:40:35 GMT 2
Hi Marius See attached. The red arrow refers to the breather pipe from the evp tank. Where did you connect that to? To my mind that is the only opening on the supply side of the fuel system. Regards Spikes Attachments:
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