Ladaniva
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A Lada Niva for a new lease of life
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Post by Ladaniva on Mar 27, 2012 13:07:55 GMT 2
Hi Charles,
"Fanus why do you not build your own HHO generator? Please let us know if it improves fuel consumption."
Yes, I am going to build it after I received the HHO kit as a proven design. There is no doubt whatsoever that the HHO kit saves a lot of fuel/money on carburettor and diesel engines. The "trick" with the fuel injected engines is only to "verneuk" (trick) the engine computer (ECU) because the exhaust is so clean it thinks it is running lean (and inject more fuel)!
I will keep you guys posted on the progress with the conversion on my son's C200 Kompressor because that is all that is relatively tricky; how to talk to the computer (ECU) so that the car do not inject more fuel to compensate for the lean/clean air in the exhaust. Never, never fiddle with the fuel mixture on a fuel injected engine if you do not use a exhaust gas temperature gauge/meter and know how to read it. Especially in South Africa with it's high altitudes in some areas.
Regards,
Fanus
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Post by Charles on Mar 27, 2012 13:18:09 GMT 2
Fanus just do not burn a hole in the merc's piston.
Charles
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Ladaniva
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A Lada Niva for a new lease of life
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Post by Ladaniva on May 7, 2012 23:44:54 GMT 2
Hi Charles,
Just a quick update on the HHO project:
I ordered a HHO kit but unfortunately the supplier did not confirm my order for almost a month now, so most probably out of business (www.hydrogaslabs.com).
Not all HHO designs are equal and less so the kits available. The in thing now is the HHO generators manufactured from stainless steel coated with titanium, because it produces a higher quality gas and the liquid does not harm the environment as when it is in contact with stainless steel.
The big reason why HHO kits are not (yet?) mainstream is that it puts a load on the alternator which many states cancels the advantage of having better combustion (the critics say it takes more energy to make HHO gas than the advantage of having better combustion).
The reasons why HHO may damage your engine are: Thermal runaway - basically the current through the HHO unit increases when the chemical process heats up. The current draw on your electrical system can increase to such an extent that the alternator will be damaged. Too much steam may enter your engine. This is the consequence of too high current flow due to thermal runaway, mentioned above, or too much chemicals added to the distilled water. The chemical/water mixture literally starts to boil making more steam than HHO gas! Engines can tolerate water and steam, but obviously too much will increase the compression ratio and mess up the fuel mixture leading to engine failure. Air/fuel mixture/ratio too lean causing valve and piston failure. The whole idea of running an engine on pump fuel and HHO is to reduce the quantity of pump fuel, because it is expensive and HHO (water) not. In order to reduce the pump fuel consumption one must lean out the mixture and compensate for this with HHO (a highly explosive mixture, exploding very fast and completely). It is very unlikely that the engine will be damaged while cruising with an HHO/pump fuel mixture, but very likely to damage an engine under full load with HHO mode switched on (unless the engine is specifically tuned for heavy load on the engine with HHO in the mix and the HHO generator is able to generate enough HHO to compensate). Incorrect fitting of a HHO system can cause an explosion under the hood. The main problem here is the very explosive nature of this specific gas and the speed with which it explodes. It explodes many times faster than an oxygen/acetylene mix, let alone a petrol/air mixture. A normal flashback arrestor used for oxygen/acetylene is far too slow for a HHO application.
Now: there are many claims on the Internet that HHO saves a lot of fuel (mostly if the engine is properly tuned after fitment, current through the HHO generator is properly controlled - a pulse width modulator is highly recommended for this), and not too much of the catalyst is added to the distilled water), but these significant fuel saving claims are still controversial. What is undoubtedly true however is that HHO cleans your engine and will therefore make an engine last much longer and will reduce maintenance cost significantly in the long run (less oil used and less filter and oil changes) - if properly installed. On-board HHO generation is however not for everybody (yet) although maintenance of the system is very low (you basically add distilled water, check that the electrical connections and pipes are still fine and that is it).
I hope the above (Internet research) is of some help, until I have build one of the latest generation HHO kits, safely installed it, dyno tuned it and tested it in practice (no fiction or emotion thrown into the deal only fuel saving facts, if any, in the long run).
Regards,
Fanus
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 8, 2012 7:35:15 GMT 2
Hi Fanus
Although I am not considering hydrogen gas as and alternative energy source for the NIVA< I have followed the correspondence on the forum closely. To me the biggest drawback, after I also did a lot of IE research was the HUGE electrical current required to run an effective hydrogen system. Thanks for the update
Spikes
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Post by Charles on May 8, 2012 10:04:58 GMT 2
Thanks for the info Fanus. Yes biggest problem is you have to put more enertgy ib thab what ou can get out.
Send me your email in a PM please. I have lost it and would like to mail you some info I have on the subject.
Charles
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Christo
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Post by Christo on May 8, 2012 20:46:52 GMT 2
Hi Guys I 'm of the opinion that this is a scam.About 3 years ago I had one installed in a Isuzu 2.8 diesel Bakkie ' it did not function properly. It pulled more than 40 amps. Sad to say it's laing someware in my garage.
Christo
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Post by Charles on May 8, 2012 21:39:58 GMT 2
University of technology in Bloem have done loads of tests and experiments and says it can not work. I would love to believe that it does work.
Charles
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 9, 2012 8:46:49 GMT 2
Hydrogen gas conversion related posts will be moved here
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 9, 2012 9:00:54 GMT 2
Big Trevor seems happy with his conversion
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bobbyd
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Post by bobbyd on May 9, 2012 12:25:53 GMT 2
One of the few secrets which is often greatly misunderstood is that these generators dont need to pull a lot of amps. I can email proven plans to anybody who wants them
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bobbyd
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Post by bobbyd on May 9, 2012 12:29:34 GMT 2
University of technology in Bloem have done loads of tests and experiments and says it can not work. I would love to believe that it does work. Charles All Varsitys research in the direction the funding providers tell them and there is no way any University is going to go aganist the oil cartels and the global elite, no way. HHO generators do work and work well.
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Post by Charles on May 9, 2012 13:32:21 GMT 2
Hi Bobby
I still have those plans and will be building one as soon as I finish the other stuff on my Niva. I want to see for myself if it works or not.
Charles
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Roons
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Post by Roons on May 9, 2012 16:26:14 GMT 2
Hi all. I made an hho generator a while ago mine did not work well. Pulled 30+ amps ang gave les than 3l per min. 3l by volume in a plastic bag. I did not even fit it to my car. Maybe it would have worked. If u can generate the power with brake force it may work a bit better?
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dimitris
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Post by dimitris on May 14, 2012 20:09:25 GMT 2
Hi all My knowledge about the hho generators are very few. So I want to ask.... How many liters of hydrogen should produce a hho generator to be efficient for the niva and how many Amp? What operating temperature is acceptable? How can we know how many liters of hydrogen have been produced by the generator ..... I mean how can we count it? Dear Trevor, you had written that the fuel consumption of your niva was 6 lit \100 km ..... 10 Amp load..... ladanivawourldwide.freeforums.org/alternate-fuel-systems-t44-30.htmlThis is magic!! Is it still valid? If it is so ...... I will definitely have many more questions!!!!! ;D ;D
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90ladaniva
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Post by 90ladaniva on May 16, 2012 14:51:30 GMT 2
Hi Dimitris,Ok the answer to your question is yes and if you need more info dont be afraid to ask mate as you wont know if you dont ask .Oh and Charles could you please move the alternative fuel thread to combine whith this one ,it is in the technical section of this forum on page 3 as ive posted links to HHO forums and info on there that i think people would find interesting .Thank you Charles .As Bobby has stated on here it does not require high Amps to run a HHO system and general rule of thumb is it takes around 3/4 to 1 litre of hho per minute for the 1600 petrol niva motor as anymore will turn all your savings the other way round and demish all gains leading to higher fuel consumption .After looking through the thread that Charles will move to here let us know if you found the info and the links usefull .Cheers Trev .
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 16, 2012 14:54:23 GMT 2
Thanks for coming back on that, Trevor! I'll move the posts. Regards Spikes
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90ladaniva
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Post by 90ladaniva on May 16, 2012 14:58:00 GMT 2
Thank you Spikes .Cheers Trev .
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 16, 2012 15:10:28 GMT 2
trevorI think I got all of them now?
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90ladaniva
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Post by 90ladaniva on May 16, 2012 16:34:48 GMT 2
Thanks again Spikes ,Well done mate .Cheers Trev
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dimitris
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Post by dimitris on May 16, 2012 20:20:14 GMT 2
Dear Trevor, thanks alot for your answer! Just now I saw the other thread and saw those useful links.... www.hho4free.com/browns_gas.htmwww.svpvril.com/svpweb9.htmlI must read a lot..... but the problem is that I have difficulty in English..... Please, I want to bring back two questions What operating temperature in the cell is acceptable? How can we know how many liters of hydrogen have been produced by the generator ..... I mean how can we count it? Cheers Dimitris
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90ladaniva
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Post by 90ladaniva on May 17, 2012 2:17:29 GMT 2
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 17, 2012 8:28:04 GMT 2
Hi Dimitris
The gas flow can be measured with an in line flow air flow (litre/min) meter NOT into a container as the systems described are not really high pressure systems designed to accumulate gas. I'll have a look for a flow meter and post a link here. If you use Google Chrome you can translate English into Greek quite easily. Jan Broes also posted a link recently to translate various languages. That is in the "Wire Connections" post
Regards
Spikes
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 17, 2012 8:41:00 GMT 2
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90ladaniva
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Post by 90ladaniva on May 17, 2012 14:23:29 GMT 2
Thanks Spikes for taking care of the flow meter for me but Dimitris needs to contact the surplier about the gas flow meter and ask if it is suitable for measuring HHO Gas as there are a number of these flow meters that are not suitable for HHO and there measurements are not correct ,or in other words they give out false readings so be sure you get the right one mate .Most people i know use the 1.5 litre bottle idea but to explaine to some one what to do is not easy so i will try to find a video or some info for you to have a look at .To get 1 litre of hho output for a 1.6 litre niva motor you should not have to use no more than 10 to 12 amps and at 12 amps the motor doesnt really drop in revs but the guys that are saying you need 30 and 40 amps to run these units seem to have a serious issue with there units so the best info you will find is on the HHO forum and ive posted the link for you above on this page .Demitris are you making a wet cell or a dry cell mate please let me know .Mine is an 18 plate wet cell .The hho Forim above has over 100 pages of valuable info on it so fellas start reading till ya just cant read no more by then you will know all there is to know and will be experts on HHO Systems .Dimitris i will answer your question on temperature and heat control on my next post .Cheers guys and be carefull when building and testing these units as they can be dangerous if not handled with respect .Cheers Guys ,Trev .
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dimitris
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Post by dimitris on May 17, 2012 18:06:44 GMT 2
Hi Well Trev..... you put me much reading and I do not know when I'll be ready to give exams!!!!! I saw many videos and read enough, so I can say that I am beginning to understand.(about cells, flow meter...etc) I haven't decided yet if I will try to build a generator, or whether to buy a complete one ....In any way I will definitely ask your opinion. I will continue reading and come back with questions ..... Thank you very much!!!! Ps. Spikes I use Google Chrome ....but believe me, Greek is a very difficult language so the translator "raises the hands up".......it won't make sense at all !!!! ;D ;D ;D
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spikes
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Post by spikes on May 17, 2012 18:54:20 GMT 2
Ps. Spikes I use Google Chrome ....but believe me, Greek is a very difficult language so the translator "raises the hands up".......it won't make sense at all !!!! ;D ;D ;D[/quote] Good luck with the technical reading in English
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dimitris
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Post by dimitris on May 17, 2012 19:30:02 GMT 2
@ Spikes Από δω και πέρα θα σου γράφω στα ελληνικά να κάνεις εσύ την μετάφραση!!!!
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Post by Charles on May 17, 2012 20:52:32 GMT 2
Δημήτρης νομίζω ότι θα ήταν καλύτερα αν όλοι κολλήσει στα αγγλικά.
Charles
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Post by Charles on May 17, 2012 20:54:03 GMT 2
I am really eager to try a HHO system. Guys just take not it is actually not hydrogen that gets generated, but Browns gas. The same gas that gets created when you charge a battery.
Charles
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90ladaniva
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Post by 90ladaniva on May 18, 2012 1:53:08 GMT 2
Hi Fellas ,Just looking at 2nd and 3rd posts above and guess what ,now me no understand ay ,Have fun guys ,Cheers Trev .
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