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Post by Charles on Aug 9, 2011 12:04:58 GMT 2
Hi all
When your Niva is idling and the clucth is released in neutral does your box also have a low rumble?
Charles
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Post by ronnie on Aug 9, 2011 12:12:11 GMT 2
Hi Charles
The intermediate shaft is out at present, so I can`t listen to it. When it was running I don`t remember any rumbles..
Ronnie
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Post by Charles on Aug 9, 2011 12:20:31 GMT 2
Mine has a slight rumble. Dont know if it just sounded excessive because I had no covers or carpet in. Wilth the underfelt in and the holes around the gear levers covered I can barely hear it. With the Niva coming together now the small things are starting to bug me more and more.
Charles
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Post by marius on Aug 9, 2011 14:02:50 GMT 2
Hi Charles
I think the low rumble is very normal on the gearbox. I was also worried about it many years ago and was advised that it was the release bearing. It turned out not to be the case.
When I fixed my gearbox I had all the bearings checked by people in the know. The same people also checked the play on all the gears when I assembled it and everything checked out perfectly. All the gears was also judged to be in excellent condition.
The low level rumble is still there after all these years. I think you should only get worried if it gets worse.
Marius
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Post by marius on Aug 9, 2011 14:05:35 GMT 2
Hi Danie
What exactly is wrong with your original gearbox and engine?
Marius
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Post by ronnie on Aug 9, 2011 14:27:57 GMT 2
Hi Charles
Like Marius I would not worry about the rumble.
Ronnie
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Post by danie on Aug 11, 2011 21:29:00 GMT 2
Hi Danie What exactly is wrong with your original gearbox and engine? Marius Hi Marius Sorry about missing your question . My Lada's original Gearbox is in a 100 % working condition - it has been repaired by a local Gearbox Center about a year ago (4th Gear jumping out), but has never been used since - because I still need to complete my Lada's restoration. As indicated elsewhere, my 2nd Gearbox will be rebuilt by another specialist - that will take place during the next week . My Lada's original engine just needs new exhaust Valves, exhaust Valve guides, and a new oil pump. Maybe a new oil pump is not really needed, but I believe it always make sense to replace an oil pump when the engine has been stripped. The engine did have piston ring problems - but that has been replaced by myself Danie
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Post by danie on Aug 12, 2011 5:46:39 GMT 2
By the way , I have ordered Gearbox Oil Seals from Pavel - because I did not know whether compatible seals are available at the local market. So when I opened the parcel , I was quite surprised to discover that the Gearbox seals which Pavel has sent me are Viton seals - unlike the standard (original Russian) rubber seals on my gearbox, which will be getting rebuilt during the next week. As mentioned previously , Viton oil seals are better quality, and are better suitable at higher heat applications. Needless to say - since I have discovered the Viton seals inside the parcel, I also became a "believer" in Russian oil seal quality. Danie
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Post by marius on Aug 12, 2011 8:19:19 GMT 2
Hi Danie Would I be wrong in thinking that your aim is to built the "Perfect Lada" and you would like to do it at a reasonable price - even if you have to go the "alternative" route. I would like to go further and say that reliability issues has not actually been a real problem for you and the only thing (apart from mulla) standing between you and a running Lada is the perfectionist in you! ;D ;D ;D Help me out if I am wrong ;D Marius
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Post by Charles on Aug 12, 2011 10:07:05 GMT 2
Danie you will also notice the VAZ part numbers on the seals.
Charles
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Post by danie on Aug 12, 2011 19:30:46 GMT 2
Hi Danie Would I be wrong in thinking that your aim is to built the "Perfect Lada" and you would like to do it at a reasonable price - even if you have to go the "alternative" route. I would like to go further and say that reliability issues has not actually been a real problem for you and the only thing (apart from mulla) standing between you and a running Lada is the perfectionist in you! ;D ;D ;D Help me out if I am wrong ;D Marius Hi Marius Let me explain this way - I actually earn my daily bread and butter by solving problems - not causing problems . ;D I do know that My "Lada involvement" might irritate ten colors of sh@t out of most people out there - but right or wrong - I do beleive that with only a few "adjustments", the Lada Niva could have been the most popular 4 X 4 in the world. ! And I am only trying do do those "adjustments" myself . Danie
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Post by marius on Aug 12, 2011 20:01:02 GMT 2
Danie I can only speak for myself, but I am in no way irritated by your comments or "involvement". To me you are one of the cornerstones of LOCSA. Judging by the amount of webspace dedicated to the Niva it is the most popular 4x4xFAR! Marius
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Post by Charles on Aug 12, 2011 21:19:03 GMT 2
Danie I enjoy all your comments.
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vincentc
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Post by vincentc on Aug 19, 2011 21:11:56 GMT 2
By the way , I have ordered Gearbox Oil Seals from Pavel - because I did not know whether compatible seals are available at the local market. So when I opened the parcel , I was quite surprised to discover that the Gearbox seals which Pavel has sent me are Viton seals - unlike the standard (original Russian) rubber seals on my gearbox, which will be getting rebuilt during the next week. As mentioned previously , Viton oil seals are better quality, and are better suitable at higher heat applications. Needless to say - since I have discovered the Viton seals inside the parcel, I also became a "believer" in Russian oil seal quality. Danie Hi Danie I recently got some seals from Ventz. They were original Viton seals, but almost all the seals on the lada are directional. If you look on the inside faces of the seal, you will see small radial lines that assist the seal in keeping oil in the component. Be careful that the seal is in the correct location or you find that the seal "pumps" oil out of the component. Regards Vincent
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Post by danie on Aug 20, 2011 7:10:35 GMT 2
Yea, when I stripped my spare front diff quite a while ago, I found both seals (sideshaft ends) at the wrong position - the Left seal had been installed at the Right, and vise versa.
At the time I thought that the function of the grooves is to work dirt away from the inside of the diff - but later realized that the seals have been installed incorrectly.
Danie
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Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Aug 20, 2011 11:06:12 GMT 2
What happens when you reverse???
Ari
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Post by danie on Aug 20, 2011 13:16:50 GMT 2
On all oil seals, if the inner lip is in good condition, the inner lip will will prevent an oil leak , and the grooves should not be that important. All modern oil seals which I know do not have any grooves - but do have two lips: 1. An inner lip prevents an oil leak 2. An outer lip which prevent dust and dirt coming close to the inner lip. www.epm.com/oil_st_lips.htmAlthough the grooves on the Russian oil seals are suppose to deflect leaking oil backwards to minimize oil leaks I think there is a possibility that should these seals become worn, the grooves could deflect oil and dirt into the diffs, gearbox, etc. Therefore I actually prefer oil seals with two lips - without the grooves. I am not sure whether oil seals on modern cars still have grooves - I think some comments by Charles could be very interesting. Danie
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Post by Charles on Aug 20, 2011 13:47:23 GMT 2
The seals all have those oil deflecting grooves. If you fit a normal seal they always leak. So we just fit the genuine seals. Have had too many problems.
Charles
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Post by ronnie on Aug 20, 2011 14:32:50 GMT 2
Hi Charles
I will not fit any seal except the genuine one. I found that out with experience.
Ronnie
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Post by danie on Aug 20, 2011 17:01:44 GMT 2
The seals all have those oil deflecting grooves. If you fit a normal seal they always leak. So we just fit the genuine seals. Have had too many problems. Charles Thanks Charles The seals which we use in our industry do not have grooves - and when in good condition, they do not leak. Therefore I believed that the high quality ones (i.e. Viton seals, without grooves) can be used in motor applications as well. Danie
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Post by ronnie on Aug 20, 2011 17:35:39 GMT 2
Hi Danie
Ventz has already posted that aftermarket seals do not work with the exception of the rear crank seal. My own experience is that only the original work, and to that end I will not use anything else bar original.
Ronnie
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Post by danie on Aug 20, 2011 17:47:03 GMT 2
Hi Ronnie
Since I am aware of the fact that "original" Lada oil seals are now available in Viton as well, I've been converted to a "stick to 'original' Lada oil seals" fan as well . ;D
Regards
Danie
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Post by Charles on Aug 20, 2011 19:28:01 GMT 2
Danie anywhere in a motor where there is some pressure involved the seals without groves do not work. I learnt the hard way a coupke of times.
Calla
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vincentc
Veteran Niva Petrol Head
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Post by vincentc on Aug 29, 2011 8:20:49 GMT 2
Hello All
Danie, you are correct in stating that the seals used on your bearing houses are not direction and all work without leaking. This is in part to the fact that your housing is vented to atmosphere. as you may know, the moment the vent is blocked, the housing leak.
All modern car engines (I am not sure if the Lada qualifies as modern) have positive crank ventilation which would mean that the seal that is not directional would piddle oil in no time at all.
Having seen the OE seal first hand, I only now buy Original seals.
Regards Vincent
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vincentc
Veteran Niva Petrol Head
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Post by vincentc on Aug 29, 2011 8:31:16 GMT 2
the Last few weeks have been very trying. I, at times, found it hard to love my lada It broke down every day for about 10 days, and then sometimes even broke down twice a day. The major issue I had was when the blanking plug pushed out of the gear box. This was the result of a broken cluster / 5th gear bolt. This I would STRONGLY recommend is also an OE only part as it can be disasterous. My run (about 15 km) without oil in the gearbox back to Ventz caused serious damage to all the bearings in the Box. Ratel can attest to how VERY noisy a Lada box can be. I decided that the 'box would need a complete strip and rebuild, so I decided to pull the 1600 box and pop it into the 1700. Ronnie popped around, 1 electric fuel pump later and a hijacked battery, the 1600 fired up and we took her around the block. All gears except 5th were able to select and the box was blissfully quiet. On stripping the end cover off the 1600 box I discovered:- a) The output shaft lock nut was so loose, the whole intermediate shaft slipped off !!!!! b) The 5th / Reverse gear bolt WAS NOT EVEN IN THE GEARBOX. The damn fool that last worked on it had not replaced it !!!!! I put the 1700 bolt in and am now riding with the 1600 box. regards Vincent
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Post by danie on Aug 29, 2011 19:28:01 GMT 2
Hello All Having seen the OE seal first hand, I only now buy Original seals. Regards Vincent Hi Vincent The seals which I have ordered from Pavel are grooved Viton oil seals - which should obviously be the best available. I guess the seals which you have seen are also Viton (brownish color ) ? If not, I would advice you rather to get your oil seals from Pavel. Regards Danie
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vincentc
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Post by vincentc on Aug 29, 2011 19:38:40 GMT 2
Hello Danie
Yes the seals are Viton and I bought them from Ventz (In original VAZ packaging)
Regards Vincent
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Post by danie on Oct 5, 2011 6:25:09 GMT 2
Does anyone know when the gearbox selector forks get coated with the yellow colored powder ? I have notice that mainly the fork ends has been coated completely on the new selectors which came from Pavel. The powder is quite course, and when rubbed hard by hand, a small percentage do comes loose - so I think the flakings will comes loose inside the gearbox , and pollute the oil anyway: I am quite sure that when new selector forks are installed in general, the gearbox oil will have to be changed very soon - to get rid of yellow flakings which came loose. Danie
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90ladaniva
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Post by 90ladaniva on Oct 5, 2011 8:28:30 GMT 2
Danie ,I would recomend that you wash the forks in petrol and see if the yellow powder washes off because to my knowlege it is not surposed to be on there and if that doesnt work go see a gear box specialist or good motor mechanic and find out first as you dont want to stuff up your rebuilt G/Box by having that flakey metal shavings in there mate .Cheers Trev .
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Post by ronnie on Oct 5, 2011 9:18:57 GMT 2
Hi Trevor and Dannie
I also would wash the forks in petrol. Don`t think it would be good to have anything like that in the oil.
Ronnie
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