|
Post by danie on Nov 27, 2010 18:29:40 GMT 2
Does anyone know at what mileage a timing chain should be changed on a Lada ?
I have a feeling that there are quite a number of Ladas out there on which the timing chains have never been changed before.
Danie
|
|
|
Post by ronnie on Nov 27, 2010 19:11:39 GMT 2
Hi Danie
In my experience a duplex chain should last the life of the motor. Wither the slipper etc will or not is another thing.
Ronnie
|
|
|
Post by marius on Nov 27, 2010 19:55:21 GMT 2
Hi Danie & Ronnie
As we all no - many things can go wrong on ANY car - esp if not maintained properly. I would expect the Niva's chain to last a very long time - if properly maintained - no reason why not.
Regards Marius
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Nov 27, 2010 20:00:37 GMT 2
At work we only replace a chain if its noisy. Most nissans run a single chain. I prefer a double. I have seen cars with 500 000Km still with the original chain.
Charles
|
|
Hercules
Veteran Niva Petrol Head
Lada - your peace of mind to take on the world's vast landscapes.
Posts: 785
Location: Gauteng
Town: Benoni
Registered: Oct 2, 2009 11:55:41 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Hercules on Nov 27, 2010 20:14:29 GMT 2
When I did my head our friend inform me that the tensioner shoe should be replaced at every 120 -140000km. He did not mentioned anything about the chain.
I also think the chain should last the lifetime of the motor. But when the chain is replaced it is best to replace the gears aswell due to the gears get worn with the chain. Old gears and a new chain will not mesh properly and will just worn the chain down.
Regards.
Hercules
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Nov 27, 2010 22:27:54 GMT 2
I fully agree with you.
Charles
|
|
|
Post by danie on Nov 28, 2010 8:35:41 GMT 2
Stupid question I guess - what does "the lifetime of the motor " mean? The first time the motor gets overhauled? Danie
|
|
Hercules
Veteran Niva Petrol Head
Lada - your peace of mind to take on the world's vast landscapes.
Posts: 785
Location: Gauteng
Town: Benoni
Registered: Oct 2, 2009 11:55:41 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Hercules on Nov 28, 2010 9:13:16 GMT 2
The design of the Lada motor is such that with proper maintenance the life of the motor is in excess of 500000km. When a motor get overhauled I think all parts with wear on should be replaced.
Regards.
Hercules
|
|
|
Post by ronnie on Nov 28, 2010 10:12:52 GMT 2
Hi Danie
AS far as the life of the motor is concerned it all boils down to how it was maintained during it`s life. For me there is no reason for it to be less than 500000km barring some unfortunate mishap which can occur to any make. Without delving into what should be replaced at this stage in detail the motor should then be "as new" two things I will mention is I never fit oversize pistons I always sleeve and rebore to standard, and I always have the motor completely balanced. This includes having pistons and conrods all the same weight. The difference it makes to the motor is enormous.
Ronnie
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Nov 28, 2010 11:28:44 GMT 2
Hi all
Just to put the prices of a Lada chain into perspective, on a 2.0l Nissan Hardbody timing chain replacement including gears, guides, tentioners, oil jet and labour is R12 000.
Charles
|
|
|
Post by ronnie on Nov 28, 2010 13:11:29 GMT 2
Hi Charles
Just another rip off, or is it to justify the high salary paid to the Mechanics ;D.,
Ronnie
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Nov 28, 2010 13:15:58 GMT 2
Ronnie I wish. Its a 6hour job. Just the tube of gasket maker is R500. But it is fantastic stuff. Haven't found anything like it aftermarket. When it dries it feels like rubber. Only thing is I dont understand anything that stands on the tube, its all in Japanese.
Charles
|
|
Nikki Lada
Senior Niva Petrol Head
Posts: 353
Registered: Jun 6, 2011 8:12:13 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Nikki Lada on Jul 17, 2012 17:52:49 GMT 2
Guys I need your urgent assistance and guidance please as I have what may turn out to be a big problem. As discussed a week or so ago under ‘Running Hot’ I took Nikita to the radiator guys today to have a thermostat fitted and get her cooling system checked out and she ended up with timing chain issues. She is now sitting in a strange garage with a mechanic I don’t know, who has never seen a Lada before, and he’s waiting for me to get back to him about what I want him to do. 1. From what I can gather, while the radiator guy was revving the engine a noise developed from somewhere under the tappet cover. 2. The Radiator guy then drove Nikita to his mechanic just down the road and they removed the tappet cover and found the damper side of the timing chain was loose. The noise was the chain hitting the tappet cover. 3. Looking at my w/s manual they also said that the NUT securing the oil pump shaft sprocket had come loose. Please advise: 1. What could have caused this – I did have the timing chain tension adjustment carried out just before Christmas. 2. What needs to be done to fix this – eg what needs to be removed, etc. 3. What needs to be done to check for any damage 4. What are the likely things that could have been damaged 5. Presumably I will need a new chain and damper,etc., as a start – does anyone have any spares I could buy and I will order a replacement from Pavel. 6. How long is the above likely to take, what is the degree of difficulty involved and what are the chances of them buggering something up. 7. What are the labour charges likely to be for something like this. As per usual any assistance will be greatly appreciated. NIKKI
|
|
Ihar
Moderator
Lada Niva Driver
Honour thy forefathers and drink beer, they did
Posts: 1,520
Location: Gauteng
Town: Roodepoort
Registered: Mar 4, 2011 17:30:11 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Ihar on Jul 17, 2012 18:00:54 GMT 2
Good luck Nikki, I will let someone more experienced answer this.
Tjeers
Steve
|
|
spikes
Moderator
Posts: 3,689
Location: Mpumalanga
Town: Nelspruit
Registered: Apr 19, 2010 19:39:51 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by spikes on Jul 17, 2012 18:35:48 GMT 2
Hi Nikki
Sorry to hear about the troubles with the NIVA. On this one I'm not going to stick my neck out.
I am sure someone who has done the change will come along and advise
regards
spikes
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Jul 17, 2012 18:53:36 GMT 2
Nikki give mike a ring. I am sure he will help.
Charles
|
|
|
Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Jul 17, 2012 19:19:27 GMT 2
Hi Nikki
3. Looking at my w/s manual they also said that the NUT securing the oil pump shaft sprocket had come loose. There is no way that they should be able to even see this nut with only the tappet cover off.
I dont know what they did but they screwed something up. If I was you I would TOW it to YOUR mechanic without the engine running.
They may have loosened the chain tensioner nut by mistake as its under on of the radiator hoses
Then he will need to check the chain and related components by removing them.
1) To do this he will have to turn the crank and cam to top dead centre. 2) Then he will need to remove the tappet cover, the fan and its shroud. 3) Then to remove the chain tensioner and the cam sprocket. 4) Then the crank pulley and front engine cover.(the water pump may need to come off as well, not sure) 5) Now you will be able to see everything in there and also what the chain is up to.
Ari
|
|
|
Post by marius on Jul 17, 2012 19:35:57 GMT 2
Hi Nikki Sorry to hear about your troubles. I am with Ari on that one. Unless you remove quite a bit of furniture you won't be able to see a problem like that Best of luck Marius
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Jul 17, 2012 19:36:26 GMT 2
I agree with Ari.
Charles
|
|
Roons
Veteran Niva Petrol Head
Posts: 583
Registered: Mar 12, 2012 22:50:37 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Roons on Jul 17, 2012 19:36:59 GMT 2
Agree with Ari. Things can go wrong quickly there. Dont let them mess around with it if u dont know or trust them.
|
|
spikes
Moderator
Posts: 3,689
Location: Mpumalanga
Town: Nelspruit
Registered: Apr 19, 2010 19:39:51 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by spikes on Jul 17, 2012 20:02:43 GMT 2
Hi Nikk
Having read Ari's reply, get the NIVA back to your usual workshop asap.
Good luck
Spikes
|
|
|
Post by Ari Bezuidenhout on Jul 17, 2012 20:05:26 GMT 2
Thats 2000 posts Spikes well done Ari
|
|
|
Post by ronnie on Jul 17, 2012 20:21:21 GMT 2
Hi Nikki
Sorry to hear about your problems, I agree take it to your usual mechanic. It is unbelievable how this could happen just changing a thermostat.
Ronnie
|
|
Nikki Lada
Senior Niva Petrol Head
Posts: 353
Registered: Jun 6, 2011 8:12:13 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Nikki Lada on Jul 17, 2012 20:24:33 GMT 2
Thanks for the response guys - this has not been a good Lada day! With regard to the NUT you couldn't actually see it - the guy put his finger down and said he could feel that a nut had come loose. As I had the w/s manual in the car I showed them the Timing Chain diagram and they pointed to the NUT securing the oil pump shaft sprocket. The theory was that the guy who worked on my cylinder head previously had never secured it properly and it had come loose. Is this a possibility and could this nut being loose cause the chain slackness on the damper side ?The radiator guy is a really fantastic guy and helps me lots of times - often without charging me and he reckons that the mechanic who now has my car is really good and only uses him. Personally, I don't trust any of them, even my regular guy, because no matter how good they are supposed to be my experience has been that none of them do anything properly. This sounds like it could turn out to be a very expensive problem and I have some serious pondering to do. NIKKI
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Jul 17, 2012 21:12:46 GMT 2
I think its time for some exploration surgery.
That bolt has a lock washer on it. Maybe the previous guy never locked the bolt with it. Stuff likr that does happen. Also bolts can come loose.
Charles
|
|
Nikki Lada
Senior Niva Petrol Head
Posts: 353
Registered: Jun 6, 2011 8:12:13 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Nikki Lada on Jul 17, 2012 22:28:17 GMT 2
Hi Guys I’ve been doing a bit of research since my last post and from what I’ve picked up on the internet it would appear that a loose timing chain can also cause overheating problems. As I mentioned earlier, although I specifically requested the timing chain adjustment during a service just before Christmas I have no actual proof that this was done. Other things I also specifically requested I know for a fact were not carried out – eg greasing the universal joints. In view of the latest problem, and as I have been troubled with overheating problems for some time despite having investigated every possible cause, could it be possible that the chain was loose and what happened was just a co-incidence?? At the time the noise developed the overheating issue had not been resolved and with the new thermostat fitted the temperature was running extremely high and the fans had no effect. The radiator guy assured me there were no leaks, no air in the system, and he was still trying to get to the bottom of the problem when the noise started. I would be very interested to hear your thoughts on this. NIKKI
|
|
|
Post by ronnie on Jul 17, 2012 22:47:47 GMT 2
Hi Nikki
I really don`t know if a loose timing chain could cause overheating but it would need to be very loose and there would of course be a lot of noise. If you have not heard anything then I doubt if that would have been the reason for your overheating. If the electric fan made no difference then the fault must lie in either the circulation (pump) or cooling (radiator). I would love to be able to see the Niva but that is not possible. Lets see what other members think.
Ronnie
|
|
|
Post by ronnie on Jul 17, 2012 23:12:16 GMT 2
Hi Nikki
I do not trust Mechanics period. (not you Charles) If the radiator guy is so good he should be able to do his job and fix it. I suppose a bolt can come loose but it is suspicious that it happens at the time they are working on the car. Again if the bolt was turning loose there would have been noise. Charles you can comment here. That pulley must have a key way so even if the bolt comes loose the chain itself would tend to keep the pulley in place and there must be noise.
Ronnie
|
|
Nikki Lada
Senior Niva Petrol Head
Posts: 353
Registered: Jun 6, 2011 8:12:13 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by Nikki Lada on Jul 18, 2012 6:22:03 GMT 2
The main thing about the radiator guy is that I have no doubt whatsoever about his honesty and if he says the mechanic is excellent he certainly believes it. I'll try to find out more during the day - in a small town this should be easy. I'll also pop around to my usual guys and find out about towing the vehicle there. It could also take some time to locate the various spares I may need and I don't think they'll be too happy with Nikita taking up valuable workshop space as they are always incredibly busy. What's the story with towing - I know there is a thread somewhere on the forum that I think Danie started but I haven't been able to find it as yet. Thank you again for all the help. NIKKI
|
|
spikes
Moderator
Posts: 3,689
Location: Mpumalanga
Town: Nelspruit
Registered: Apr 19, 2010 19:39:51 GMT 2
Karma: Exalt | Smite
|
Post by spikes on Jul 18, 2012 7:02:18 GMT 2
Hi Nikki
towing in Malelane should not be a problem. Put the T/c in neutral as well as the main gear lever.
regards
Spikes
|
|